dotinthesky | The 4-minute post

Current Mood: curious

The 4-minute post

I'm unprepared for today's cold spell, my lips are chapped, and I'm wondering why perfectly intelligent ~~breeders~~ straight people insist on using the word gay in a derogatory form:

Did you see her outfit last night? She looked sooooo gay!

Oh my God! Backstreet Boys are soooo gay!

I was, like, on the phone to my friend Chad and he said the gayest thing!

We are not amused. By "we", I mean gay people who have grown up knowing that something was slightly different about them, who had effeminate voices (like myself) and had to put up with other kids calling them names. Why do you want to squash us like that? In any case, "gay" means happy - so why try to bastardize the word and make it negative?

Are you one of those people that reads Vice magazine because you are soooo cool, and you feel soooooo post-modern and above caring? The people who I've seen using the word "gay" in a pejorative form are people who have gay friends. Maybe everyone is so sophisticated and beyond caring. Maybe I'm guilty too because I've made mix tapes for my friends with Patti Smith's song "Rock and Roll Nigger".

Should you and I not care about words anymore?

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It's funny how words change their use... 'gay' has undergone a complete reversal of fortune from the original meaning really. It is insulting to hear the word used in an insulting context. I find it slightly annoying that people use the word 'girl' as a euphemism for 'weak person' sometimes too, although I must admit I do use both occasionally amongst close friends in a non-aggressive way.

Unfortunately, ignorant pikeys are never likely to achieve anything more than a rudimentary grasp of language and so certain words and phrases will always be subjected to blanket missuse. It only serves to make them look thick and inarticulate, so I would try not to dwell on it too much.

You are probably right. The people who I've seen using the word, though, are quite intelligent and nice too. I'm just curious because on one hand they expound great care for gays but on the other they use the word "gay" pejoratively. Maybe their gay friends gave them permission?

I am guilty of using gay in that way, but it is more the way I was raised and the neighbourhood I grew up in. I think it is worse when people still use it, but think that spelling it ghei or something makes it better.

I also say things are retarded, and I cannot stop myself.

And hey, you know I am bisexual, but that is no excuse. I just think that people are far too politically correct nowadays, and that people have become far too sensitive regarding certain things.

*shrugs*

I haven't even had coffee yet, Ollie, so don't be too harsh on me. At least I am admitting I do say it...so anyone who decides to be noesy and bash my comment to you, I will just ignore them.

I think you are right in the sensitive aspect... maybe I'm being too sensitive. I asked Kevin today what he thought of it and he said it was the one thing he hated. Also, my younger brother is "retarded", i.e. with mental difficulties, but that hasn't stopped me from calling people retarded. It's definetly based on my conditioning (people around me using it) so perhaps the whole "gay" thing is also that.

yeah, it sucks, and I don't like to use it as an excuse, but if growing up, you were around lots of people who spoke that way, it tends to be something you aren't fully concious of. I do catch myself at times, before saying gay or retarded...but often it slips

I think that English has to suffer through how people use it...more specifically, the word 'gay' is in a weird limbo where several different slang meanings compete with each other for usage. To be honest, when I say something is 'gay' (I'm guilty), I am not even sure what I mean. I certainly don't have any actual part of my brain actively considering a comparison with a homosexual. At the same time, I know that I can't claim to use a word without considering or realizing its meaning...

I also think the evolution of language is, at once, an incredibly sophisticated and incredibly dispicable process. :D

I have long gone by the motto that words have no meaning until you give them meaning. So I find people getting insulted by words to be the bigger offence. I could sit here telling you to fuck off in a language you don't understand and you could perceive what I'm saying to be anything, but then if I told you the meaning of what I was saying would you then take offence at the same words you had previously assigned no meaning to? If so, then the offence is all in your head.

This is one of the problems with American (and to some extent Canadian & British) society today. There are now words that are verboten. Why? Because some ignorant fools wish to take insult from them? Well they are the one choosing to get insulted, why should I be denied hearing language spoken to satisfy what is going on in some moron's head. Trust me when I say this. If I really want to insult someone, I can do a far more effect job of it, by using articulate language above crass terms & expressions like: Fuck you, nigger, faggot, tub-of-lard, asshole, etc, etc. Those stupid words and expressions are meaningless. It is the audience that chooses to assign the derogatory meaning and take offence.

I am sick and tired of a politically correct world where our freedom of speech is slowly being chipped away at because any number of groups of people choose to get offended. When will it stop and who has the right to decide what is kosher? If someone uses a term that upsets you, you can simply choose to discount them as a person, but words by themselves can not be offensive. Only the individual is capable of making them offensive in their own head.

I am reminded of what Dee Snider (singer of rock group Twisted Sister) once said. "people kept calling me a sick motherfucker. But I like who I am as a person and if they are calling me a sick motherfucker that must be good, because I'm a cool person. So I must be a sick motherfucker and that's just great. I'm proud to be a sick motherfucker." I think these are words to live by!

So true!

This is a really cool thing that you just wrote, and it's funny Ollie, that you mention this because I was just thinking about the word slut, and what it means and then I read, and posted that article by Mark Morford. And it's really what we define the words as. I mean I swear, and I swear a lot, but that's just me, I don't do it to be shocking or offend people. To me they are just extreme words to express my emotions. Like wow that song is so fucking good. I mean that's something I say all the time and think really nothing much of it. But other people would be shocked and offended that's part of my regular vocabulary. I don't know.

I agree that our society had definatly swung too far the other way, and our language is becoming so santized to make sure that we dont' offend anyone. It's part of life, we can't just go through always feeling good about everything and everyone. Sometimes things shock and offend, sometimes they disgust us, and sometimes they make us happy. I just think that we are losing a lot, by being afraid that we may or may not offend someone with the words or phrases that we use.

When you call someone a bastard, do you mean they have done something that's particularly wicked or naughty, or are you criticising them for being born out of wedlock? Yet bastard was originally used for the latter purpose, but it's got distorted over the years.

Same with "gay". When I say a television show is "gay", I don't mean it's homosexual, or even that homosexuality is a bad thing. The usage of the term "gay" in that context may have originally have had homosexual connotations, but I sincerely doubt that most people using it now would even consider making the connection.

Lots of people around me have used the word "gay" to describe something that is crap; as a result, without thinking I'll pick up and use the terminology too. It may have offensive overtones if you interpret what is said to its literal meaning, but of course, 99.9% of the time, no offence is intended, or even considered. I appreciate you might find it annoying (in presumably much the same way I abhor the casual use of the c**t word) but I think for most people using it, it has long since lost any negative homosexual meaning which is why so many of your friends use it.

I'll try not to use it around you if it upsets you that much though; it's just something I very occasionally say at present - I'll probably pick up another word before too long to use instead.

It's true, words are almost changing their meanings too fast - and perhaps gay is just one of them. Just look at the word queer too, how it was once very derogatory and has now been co-opted by the gay movement.

My main beef seems to be the schizophrenic use of the word: applying it for negative things and experiences on one hand, followed by a descriptive use of a friend or loved one. It's like that other word "bitch" - which can be used to denote power but also put a woman down (depending on who's using it, I guess.)

I vote for more consistency in word-usage so I don't have to take so much time deciphering people's intentions!

Good points. Still, I think certain derogatory words are used more often than others because they bring less risk to the person who is using them.

For example, you might not feel undeterred at all about using the word "faggot" because deep down you know that if a gay person is around, they aren't going to call you on it or try to beat you up (most likely.) But would you be as comfortable swinging the word "nigger" around a room with big black guys? It's not about their ignorance in seeing your words as just words - it's about a historical link to the word which brings pain to their experience, which brings shame. Words can create images in our head which are quite strong. Try calling your grandfather a pedophile and see how he reacts.

As human beings, we have to agree on a decent form to address each other - so we can live in peace. Being a shit disturber might be good fun for a while, and it's certainly the "punk" thing to do, but it doesn't contribute to a peaceful world.

But shouldn't we try to not hurt others if we can? I've never been called a faggot, and I'd like to believe that I wouldn't care if somebody did... but I think I'd probably be very hurt and find it to be an attack on my person.

To be honest, it doesn't offend me that much. I was just curious because it's a very schizophrenic use of the word: applying it to both negative and positive things. I think you explained it well why people use it.

Yes - it is indeed odd how it can be used both positively and negatively. Kind of like describing a pile of shiny gadgets as both "that's some serious shit in that pile" and "that's a seriously shit pile". Odd!

but fun?

:)

I'm in serious need of lightening up.

You need more gossip, I think!!

Yes! Where's the juicy gossip hiding these days?

I totally understand what you are saying hun, and I mean that's the whole thing. It's how we take the words. I don't think that being called a slut is a bad thing, because I choose not to let it bother me. I know what i am all about. And I don't care what anyone else thinks of what I do, and how I carry myself. I think the most important thing to realize is that someone that says something like that is doing it either because a) they don't know you or b) they do know you and they are just doing it to hurt you. Don't be controled by others and what's in their hearts or minds.

Nobody has done anything scandalous or exciting for weeks. Haven't even had a livejournal deleation for some time! It must be the summer holidays; i.e. Not February.

Don't worry, the lull will pass, and we'll be back to the usual scandal and horror on a daily basis within a few months.

I agree with you. But going back to my original point, using the word "gay" for a negative meaning - then turning around and using it to describe a friend - seems to be very contradictory and juvenile. It's perhaps not even offensive, but just plain lame. Perhaps it's just too easy a word to use for putting down others or things. If someone calls you a slut, they aren't being ambiguous about it - same if they call you a bastard, a whore. I guess I'm not really upset with people using the word gay like that because most of my livejournal friends, for example, do so. I was merely curious because I wanted to know if it was a conscious decision to link the word gay (which represents homosexuals) with being negative... and by the looks of it, I think people do it without much thought on that.

:( well that sucks, but don't be hurt by it. It's unintended I suppose. I am sorry

I hope so. Cybergoths are a lot more entertaining than Brazilian soaps.

:P

No! Don't worry... I guess my post sounds a bit huffy-and-puffy, but I'm really not that much concerned about it. It irritates me a bit because when I read the word gay I think "oh that's me!" then I'm slightly let down if I notice that the word is being used to describe J-Lo's latest movie.

:)

It could also be that the scandal has moved over to Big Brother. With all that's (apparently - I hate the thing!) happening over there, the scandal part of the brain is being fulfilled, so nobody sees fit to start anything, or investigate anything further. Tis a darned shame :-/

Roll on the end of Big Brother!

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