dotinthesky | A Push and a Shove, and the Land that We Stand on is Ours

I just witnessed teenagers attack a group of men in the No. 8 bus. I was on my way home from Brick Lane (having left Kevin behind because he has a larger tolerance of crowds than me), staring out of the bus' window, when I heard a teenage girl talking loudly into her cellphone. She was screaming "how could I call you if your mobile was turned off?" If you've seen the Vicky Pollard skit in Little Britain, multiply that by a 100 and you get the idea.

She kept up the loud behaviour, enliciting giggles from her two friends, until a man talking on his cellphone described her as "trash". After some abuse thrown at him, because how dare him call her "trash", she seemed to move her attention somewhere. The bus then stopped, and as he leaned down to pick up a box of flowers he had bought, she said "take your flowers and go home." Understandably, he stepped on her foot as he walked away; she stood up with a scream and shoved him. His friend, looking completely bewildered, got two shoves and pushes from her, to the sound of her friends laughing. They were proper violent shoves that made one of the guys hit someone sitting up ahead. If that wasn't enough, she then stood up on a seat and tried to spit at them through the window, calling them "cunts".

As you can imagine, I desperately wanted to grab her by the hair and punch her face. Perhaps I'd be applauded by the horrified bus; perhaps I'd end up in the nearest police station. Honestly, with a trip to Brasil just around the corner, I couldn't take the chance of getting in trouble.

Who, in their right minds, calls a London teenager "trash" to their face? They were obviously new in town.

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If you had been there, you would have watched in horror at the behaviour of this girl. She wasn't behaving like a typical chav; she was on overdrive, screaming and shouting, making a complete nuisance of herself. It was parody times a hundred. The person on the mobile phone must have asked him "what's that noise?" to which he said "some trash on the bus", or something similar. He had every right to speak his mind; why shouldn't he? Why should she be allowed to disrupt everyone's peace, make the journey on a public bus uncomfortable? Why should he whisper into his mobile phone so not to offend this highly offensive individual? Why should people take that kind of verbal abuse without speaking up?

In London, we are constantly burdened with people playing loud music in buses, being verbally abusive, throwing chips on people's heads -- all kinds of behaviour that receive only silence in response. Perhaps he should have been more polite and asked her to be quiet, but I think he was completely in his right to describe her as trash to his friend on the phone. The fact that she then took that as a reason to up her voice and cover him with verbal abuse was horrifying to watch. Everyone was incredibly tense and disgusted with her behaviour (which was encouraged by her two laughing friends.)

As I mentioned in the post, he was carrying a large box with flowers. Did he step on her foot on purpose? Probably. But maybe it was an accident since he was trying to maneuver out of the bus carrying the box. Again, her reaction was completely over the top -- extremely violent and disgusting to witness. Everyone watched in silence and didn't say a word. Was her behaviour acceptable? Absolutely not.

To me, it had nothing to do with class or misoginy. It was one person disrespecting another. I can see your point about him starting it (i.e. giving her rope to escalate the abuse); in his place, I would have asked the driver to stop the bus, and I would have called the police. But people behave differently under stress and I really can't fault him for reacting to her the way he did.

I am not saying she should be able to be a nuisance. I am not excusing anything she did. She was wrong. She sounds like a hot damn mess, but the man was also wrong. The way the guy DEALED WITH IT did in no way, shape, or form solve the problem. Rather it just fed into business as usual. With you lot on the bus, pearl clutching and teeth sucking and tsk tsk-ing at what you deem "typical chav" behaviour, this man's actions helped maintain/reproduce the status quo. What he did was middling and boring and mundane, but violent nonetheless. The very violence which I assumed the nation was trying to move away from. The very violence that the news reports claimed the government was so stressed and overburdened over. Of course this all is to do with classism and misogyny! Nothing happens in a vacuum. There are overlapping systems which I wont bore you with because you are a smart man and know all about it.

To me, it was a repeat of various scenes I've witnessed on public transportation, where teenagers are violent and abusive. Every single time, people remain quiet out of fear of getting into a fight, getting knifed etc. There's no sense of moral support, of people standing up together and demanding those teenagers are thrown out, etc.

I agree that the man was wrong to respond because, ultimately, it fed into her attention-seeking behaviour and pushed him into a position where he took her abuse and couldn't do anything in response without ending up in prison.

There's no sense of moral support, of people standing up together and demanding those teenagers are thrown out, etc.

I agree that people should be coming together to address problems of poverty, crime, and social unrest however his man's behaviour did nothing to rally the moral support you are speaking of. His behaviour served to further isolate and polarize people.

Also, I am interested to know why you didn't get involved....

I didn't feel like it was possible to argue with her. Even before her altercation with him began, her entire attitude was very aggressive and not open to "discussion". It's just impossible to argue with teenagers when their mode is showing off for each other, or displaying bravado in public because of some twisted idea about "respect".

I was once in a bus where I witnessed a teenager threaten an old lady. She spoke back at him and he made a gesture at her like she was dead (pointing his finger at her as if it was a gun.) There were two teenagers at the back laughing at the old woman, encouranging this guy. When I looked at them, one of them started harassing me, saying "you are marking my face? Well, I marked your face". I knew that if I had challenged him, or spoke back, nobody in the bus would have stood by my side. I didn't think it was worth it, considering the amount of people who make it on the news as a victim of public transport violence.

With what happened yesterday, we just sat there as if watching a movie, tense... just one thinking leading into another. Honestly, when she started hitting them and spitting, I thought they would call the police. But they didn't, the bus moved on, and soon it was my turn to get off. I didn't think it was worth challenging her and getting some of her spit.

A Push and a Shove, and the Land that We Stand on is Ours

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